[SAM] SAM RG interim meeting results
Eiichi Muramoto
muramoto.eiichi at jp.panasonic.com
Mon Jun 4 17:32:03 EDT 2007
Dear Jun,
We submitted an ID on this. URL for the software is written.
Comments including the one to correct my English are expected. (^^;
Title : Experimental Deployment Method for Router Supported ALM using PlanetLab
Author(s) : E. Muramoto, et al.
Filename : draft-muramoto-irtf-sam-exp-testbed-00.txt
Pages : 12
Date : 2007-5-4
This document describes the experiment method of router supported ALM
using PlanetLab.
A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-muramoto-irtf-sam-exp-testbed-00.txt
Jun Lei wrote:
>Dear Eiichi,
>
>thanks for your message. We are interested in working over PlanetLab.
>And I agree with you that PlanetLab can be regarded as one of the most
>promising candidates to test the overlay networks(routing protocols)
>under the real environment.
>
>Could you please show me some detailed description of your software? I
>would like to take a look at it.
>
>Thank you anyway
>
>Jun
>> Hello,
>>
>> I think that the test bed where overlay was used is profitable for
>> researchers ( experimenters). The experimenter can construct his
>> experiment network on Planetlab momentarily, can bigin the "user-
>> opt-in" experiment freely, and it is possible to stop it safly.
>>
>> For example, we xcast person can construct IPv6 routing plane
>> on to the planetlab using the "orbit" tunnel(IPv6 over IPv4)
>> and settle l2tp servers on the slice of planetlab for the users.
>> and begin the xcast routing experiment.
>>
>> Some might think he want to experiment on his hybrid solution
>> of ALM and IP multicast. He probably make a multicast enable network
>> and settle a ALM-IP multicast-bridge.
>>
>> Testbed sometimes accelerates the research works.
>>
>> I think we can discuss about it in this RG.
>> Do you agree? Any comment?
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Eiichi Muramoto.
>>
>>
>> Nobuo Kawaguchi wrote:
>>
>>>Dear SAM-RG members,
>>>
>>>In the last P2PM07 workshop, I had a demonstration
>>>about overlay network on PlanetLab with MyPLC.
>>>The presentation material is
>>>http://www.samrg.org/p2pm07/presentations/XcastOnPlanetLab20070111.pdf
>>>
>>>We are currently planning to open our demonstration softwares.
>>>By using our softwares, one can utilize UML on PlanetLab and
>>>connect UML nodes using UDP tunnel. Our "orbit" software can manage the
>>>configuration of all UDP tunnels from a single conf file.
>>>In the UML node, one can run any Linux binary using usual ethernet
>>>interfaces over virtual links.
>>>In our demonstration, we modified UML kernel to use
>>>XCAST6(eXplicit Multi-Unicast) so that we can show xcast routing
>>>over UML nodes.
>>>
>>>Is there any person who are interested to use our software?
>>>We are willing to write a document for interested persons.
>>>
>>>I think, for SAM-RG, PlanetLab is one of the candidate to test the
>>>overlay networks(routing protocols) for real environment.
>>>Our UML trial can regarded as a start point.
>>>We are also planning to write "Internet-Draft" about our overlay
>>>configuration.
>>>
>>>If you have any suggestion about I-D or our softwares,
>>>please let me know.
>>>
>>>Best regards,
>>>Nobuo Kawaguchi
>>>--
>>>Nagoya Univ.
>>>
>>>
>>>John Buford wrote:
>>>
>>>>Presentations and meeting notes for the Jan 11 interim SAM RG meeting
>>>>are available here:
>>>>
>>>>http://www.samrg.org/about/meetings/meetings.html
>>>>(not all slides are available yet, they will be uploaded as they
>>>>become available)
>>>>
>>>>Presentations made at the P2PM07 workshop are available here:
>>>>http://www.samrg.org/p2pm07/program.html
>>>>
>>>>(not all slides are available yet, they will be uploaded as they become
>>>>available)
>>>>
>>>>We are currently planning to hold an RG meeting at IEFT 69 (Chicago).
>>>>
>>>>Minutes from the meeting follow.
>>>>
>>>>===============================================================
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Meeting Notes
>>>>Scalable Adaptive Multicast RG
>>>>Interim Meeting Jan 11, 2007.
>>>>
>>>>1. John Buford (Panasonic)
>>>>
>>>>Overview of problem statement draft
>>>>and the existing technologies available
>>>>(ALM, Overlay multicast, Proxied overlay
>>>>multicast, tunneling with native multicast
>>>>islands).
>>>>An example architecture and some
>>>>operational scenarios.
>>>>
>>>>1. Jeremy Mineweaser (MIT Lincoln Labs)
>>>>
>>>>Adaptativity depends on suitable metrics
>>>>and ability to collect these metrics in
>>>>real-time and feedback to the network.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Discussion:
>>>>
>>>>KA: Do you think adaptive approach is too complex to be worth the benefit?
>>>>JM: remains to be seen
>>>>KA: We don't really have a one-size-fits-all protocol
>>>>
>>>>2. Mark Pullen (GMU)
>>>>
>>>>Unlike commercial ISPs,DoD ISPs have an incentive
>>>>to use multicast to reduce congestion.
>>>>But universal deployment in GIG may not work any better
>>>>than in commercial sector.
>>>>Gaming community can use multicast in different ways
>>>>than DoD since they don't require the real-world fidelity.
>>>>
>>>>In battlefield, reliability and robustness may not be
>>>>fully achievable.
>>>>
>>>>We at GMU have a prototype to manage multicast using
>>>>web services in cooperation with Naval Post-Graduate school.
>>>>
>>>>There is a need for a framework to interoperate
>>>>different mechanisms, a pervasive interoperability should be targeted.
>>>>Need the pieces to interoperate in order to mix and match technologies.
>>>>Would like to see a standardized tunneling mechanism as well.
>>>>Could use the framework for "relative" QoS not absolute QoS.
>>>>Relative QoS is important for military applications.
>>>>
>>>>3. Keith Ross (Polytechnic)
>>>>
>>>>P2P Multicast is an IPTV case study
>>>>There are several success stories: PPLive, Coolstream, ppstream
>>>>200K users at 400-800 kbps for Chinese New Years
>>>>
>>>>What are the challenges?
>>>>- Bandwidth intensive
>>>>- peers dynamic
>>>>- asymetric residential access
>>>>- incentives for redistribution
>>>>- lags among viewers
>>>>- security (pollution, overtaking for DDoS)
>>>>
>>>>Comparison of two Architectures
>>>>- Push, tree-based designs, eg. ESM from CMU
>>>>- Pull, meshed based designs
>>>> Inspired from BiTorrent
>>>> But with live streaming
>>>> More successful than ESM
>>>>
>>>>Overview of pull-mesh
>>>>Locate other peers watching same channel
>>>>Establish TCP connection
>>>>Ask neighbors what chunks they have
>>>>Request and receive chunks
>>>>Start media player
>>>>Upload chunks to others
>>>>
>>>>Presents some measurements of download
>>>>vs upload rate for different users
>>>>
>>>>Popular and unpopular channels
>>>>Pull-mesh / IPTV is killer application for multicast
>>>>
>>>>JM: what are limitations?
>>>>KR: free-riding problem, susceptibility to pollution attack
>>>>Audience: what is the performance comparison between pull and push
>>>>KR: coolstreaming paper has analysis that shows the ESM
>>>> is not good under churn
>>>>JB: what about licensed content?
>>>>KR: yes, content provides can see this as another distribution channel
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>4. Kurt Tutschku (U. Wuerzburg)
>>>>
>>>>Challenges on scalable multicast in overlay with mobile networks
>>>>There are several challenges due to mobile nodes in an overlay
>>>> which translate to problems with overlay multicast with mobile
>>>> nodes
>>>>These problems relate to roaming in the native network,
>>>>node performance capability, variation in network connectivity etc.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>5. Wenjun Zeng (U. Missouri)
>>>>
>>>>Do you plan to consider reliability, congestion control,
>>>> etc., in the design?
>>>>Pull vs push is an important distinction, as made by Keith
>>>>Is there a hybrid of pull vs push?
>>>>E.g., tree-bone based approach
>>>>
>>>>6. General Discussion
>>>>
>>>>What about data aggregation for sensor
>>>>data collection (ad hoc wireless networks),
>>>>is there a multicast solution for this case,
>>>>and how does it fit?
>>>>
>>>>The benefits of an overlay approach for launching SAM framework:
>>>>Overlays provide a number of interesting functions including
>>>>search, indexing, relaying, topology characterization, measurement.
>>>>Integrating awareness of native multicast in to the overlay is
>>>>another function like these others that a specific overlay can
>>>>chose to use or not depending on application requirements.
>>>>
>>>>Solutions to the problems of overlays in terms of reliability
>>>>and security can be used for multicast reliability and security
>>>>perhaps.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>SAM mailing list
>>>>SAM at irtf.org
>>>>https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sam
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>SAM mailing list
>>>SAM at irtf.org
>>>https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sam
>>
>>
>> -----
>> muramoto.eiichi at jp.panasonic.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> SAM mailing list
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>> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sam
>
>
>--
>Jun Lei
>PhD Student
>
>Address:
>Georg-August-Universitaet Goettingen
>Institut fuer Informatik
>Telematics Group
>Lotzestrasse 16-18
>37083 Goettingen
>
>
>Fax: +49 (551) 39-1 44 03
>Tel: +49 (551) 39-1 35 78
>
>Email: lei at informatik.uni-goettingen.de
-----
muramoto.eiichi at jp.panasonic.com
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